News Blog - Tulsa Law Firm:

Jan 13

Why A Post New Year’s Divorce May Be Beneficial

A New Year can lead to new hope and new beginnings. This notion holds particularly true for people who have been involved in a tumultuous relationship.

Compromise and a re-commitment of the relationship would be ideal in a perfect world. But as 2020 continually reinforced, life is not always ideal. Sometimes a permanent break is needed in which case divorce becomes a viable option.

Although January has been dubbed by many to be “Divorce Season” or “Divorce Month,” there is some merit to proceeding with the decision to move on and get a post New Year’s divorce from your spouse.

A Divorce can Provide a Fresh Start to New Year

The New Year provides people the opportunity to make resolutions – being a happier and better version of oneself is certainly one of best decisions one can make.

If you have continually been unhappy in your marriage, perhaps the best way to find happiness and solace within yourself may mean beginning the New Year with a blank slate. There is no shame in removing yourself from dysfunctional and unfulfilling marriage, particularly if you have been subject to narcissistic or abusive behavior.

A Post New Year’s Divorce Provides Some Financial and Emotional Incentives

There is no denying the fact that there is a cost associated with divorce – both emotionally and financially. The burden of the latter can often be softened by waiting until after the New Year to file.

Waiting until after the New Year to file for a divorce provides some financial incentives, particularly tax benefits. Not only will waiting until after the New Year allow you to avoid interferences with joint tax filings from the previous year, it also enables you the opportunity to file jointly one last time.

Emotionally, waiting until January or soon thereafter to file for a divorce also allows you the opportunity to get through what typically is an already stressful-holiday season. This especially holds true when children are involved.

Above all, waiting until the New Year or shortly thereafter allows one to make the decision of getting a divorce with a clear head and clean slate.

Consult with an Experienced Team of Tulsa Divorce Lawyers

Divorce is complicated and life-changing. The idea of ending a relationship which was supposed to be forever is both challenging and emotional and why you should not go through the process alone.

For over 50 years, the name Fry & Elder has been synonymous with Oklahoma family law excellence. The firm’s team of family law attorneys not only are some of most skilled and experienced in the Tulsa area, they are well-versed in managing divorces on all parts of the conflict spectrum. These include everything from simple dissolutions to high-conflict divorces.

Regardless of the scenario, Fry & Elder’s knowledgeable and talented team of attorneys will meticulously analyze your case and develop unique solutions tailored to fit your individual needs.

Contact Fry & Elder today to set up a personal consultation.

Jan 6

Dealing with Borderline Personality Disorders in Family Court

With over 50 years of experience practicing family law in various Northeastern Oklahoma courtrooms, Robert G “Hap” Fry Jr. has long been considered the industry “gold standard” of Tulsa family law excellence.

So when the iconic Tulsa family law attorney was invited to participate in the Annual Family Law CLE Day put on by the Tulsa County Bar Association (TCBA) this past December, it was not at all surprising that Fry’s presentation was well attended by some of the bigger names in the Tulsa legal community.

“I thought it went great,” Fry said. “The TCBA always does such a great job with these events and they were very receptive to me presenting and of my ideas for the presentation.”

Fry not only displayed is technical prowess – using Zoom and a PowerPoint – to broadcast his presentation, the highly-regarded attorney also used the presentation as opportunity to tackle a very serious issue in Oklahoma family law courts: Dealing with Borderline Personality Disorders in Family Court.

“I think it is a very serious issue,” Fry said. “If your client shows signs or has a history of being mentally unstable, they are likely going to be very difficult to work with moving forward and could end up being their own worst enemy in a pending divorce or child custody case.

“While I cannot legally determine whether or not a someone has a personality disorder, I think I can recognize instability or potential problems down the road when I meet with them.”

Fry said dealing with those suffering from personality disorders is comparable to divorcing someone who is a narcissist.

During his CLE presentation, Fry told participants that he evaluates a variety of verbal and non-verbal cues when he consults with prospective clients. Some of these include:

Their capacity to focus
Their ability to make eye contact
If they are really listening to what I say
Are they too easily led?
Are they impossible to lead?
Are there drug issues: marijuana moving up to meth and opioids as a history?
Was there treatment?
Are they capable of accepting responsibility for their own actions or are they, i.e. blaming their spouse, their spouse’s parents, their parents, mediator, parenting coordinator, counselor, their own attorney, or the other attorney?

There are other questions that Fry asks and things he discusses during an initial consultation with a prospective client, but Fry said perhaps the two biggest takeaways a potential client needs to walkaway knowing is that he or she needs to willingly accept responsibility for some of his or her actions. The other is that presently he or she is their ex-spouse’s best witness, which is what will need to change.

Fry closed out the CLE presentation by stating that the final thing he has a potential client do before signing a contract which is anonymously answer 15 True/False questions from a 488-question based MMPI-2.

“If they answer false to five or more of those, they need to be aware that they have some personality issues,” Fry said. “They can get better, but they need to recognize some of their issues and begin to seriously work at changing their behavior.”

Contact Fry & Elder today to set up a personal consultation with Fry.

Nov 10

Fry & Elder Tabbed Again for Tulsa Family Law Excellence

Eight is pretty great for Fry & Elder.

The U.S. News & World Report recently unveiled its eagerly awaited “Best Law Firms” List, and for an eight consecutive year Fry & Elder was recognized for its excellence in the Tulsa family law.

Fry & Elder again received Tier 1 status for Family Law in Tulsa for the upcoming 2021 Best Law Firms edition to further solidify its stature as an elite Tulsa family law firm.

“Tremendous honor,” Robert G “Hap” Fry Jr. said. “I know I’ve said it before, but the firm and I never take any of these awards or accomplishments for granted. You never know what tomorrow will hold, and I think this year has been a pretty good example of why that holds true.

“It’s been a difficult year on most everyone – our firm included. To be included again by the U.S. News & World Report in its annual Best Law Firms List, I think speaks volumes of how hard we work for our clients and for one another here at Fry & Elder.”

Fry knows something about hard work and legal excellence. Earlier this year. he was named to Best Lawyers® 2021 Listings. It marked the 11^th consecutive year the dynamic Tulsa family law attorney had received accolade.

Still, Fry is the first to say that much of the credit for his firm’s continued success deserves to go to its fine teams of attorneys, which included James R. Elder, James C. Morton, Kasey Currey, Simon Harwood, and James Caputo and its dedicated legal staff which features Judy Willits and Jody Geiger.

“I think we’ve really got a great team intact here,” Fry said. “Everyone works hard and is willing to help one another out which really goes a long way.”

Fry & Elder Again in Elite Legal Company

That Fry & Elder was named to this year’s Best Law Firms List, let alone for an eighth consecutive year, is no small feat.

Best Lawyers CEO Phillip Greer stated in a release:

“For the 2021 ‘Best Law Firms’ publication, the evaluation process has remained just as rigorous and discerning as it did when we first started 11 years ago. This year we reviewed 15,587 law firms throughout the United States – across 75 national practice areas – and a total of 2,179 firms received a national law firm ranking. We are proud that the ‘Best Law Firms’ rankings continue to act as an indicator of excellence throughout the legal industry.”

Contact Fry & Elder today to set up a personal consultation with a trusted and recognized Tulsa family law attorney.

Aug 20

Hallmark of Consistency: Fry Selected Again by Best Lawyers®

No one will say that 2020 has gone as planned. Yet, as surprising, unsettling and disturbing as the year has become, there are a few consistencies which remain intact. Best Lawyers® announced its 2021 listings for its annual directory Aug. 20, and Robert G “Hap” Fry Jr. was again selected for inclusion.

It should come as no surprise.

The upcoming year will mark the 11^th consecutive year Fry has been selected, yet the acclaimed attorney’s run of success dates much further back.

Fry has been synonymous with Tulsa family law excellence for over 50 years during what has been a remarkable legal career at Fry & Elder.

“He never ceases to amaze me,” longtime friend and firm partner James R. Elder said. “He’s supposed to be slowing down a little, but he has not. This year has been one of his best years, especially when you consider all the out-of-control things which have happened in 2020. Most people seek to avoid stress; he thrives on it.”

The year has certainly been one of the most documented for Fry both personally and professionally.

The iconic Tulsa attorney was the subject of four separate feature stories by three leading Tulsa media publications. The below stories spotlighted everything from Fry’s celebrity dog Badger to his immediate family to his unique charitable hobby and, of course, his nationally recognized law firm.

“It’s been a very interesting and challenging year on a variety of fronts for everyone, and it’s not over yet,” Fry said. “I’m not sure I have any profound insight on how to handle things, but I try my best to look at each day with a positive outlook. Some days are easier than others, but work has always been a great outlet for me. I feel very comfortable and at home working on legal issues and consulting with clients and attorneys.”

Fry’s passion for his work has been well documented and has not gone unnoticed for some time. He was proactive in embracing and advancing the changes in child support guidelines in the 1980s, which drew national attention.

He was interviewed on CBS The Early Show in a divorce series entitled, “What About the Kids?”

Still, that Fry has been listed by The Best Lawyers in America© every year since 2011 is no small feat. The publication is widely viewed as the oldest and most respected peer-review publication in the legal profession.

Much of this has to do with the rigorous selection process Best Lawyers® employs. Lawyers are not permitted to pay any fee to participate in or be recognized by Best Lawyers. As the website states:

“Recognition by Best Lawyers® is based entirely on peer review. Our methodology is designed to capture, as accurately as possible, the consensus opinion of leading lawyers about the professional abilities of their colleagues within the same geographical area and legal practice area.

“Best Lawyers employs a sophisticated, conscientious, rational, and transparent survey process designed to elicit meaningful and substantive evaluations of the quality of legal services. Our belief has always been that the quality of a peer-review survey is directly related to the quality of the voters.”

Even though the selection marks 11 years and counting for the well-known Tulsa family law attorney, Fry remains very thankful for honors such as these and doesn’t take anything for granted, particularly in a year such as 2020.

“It’s a tremendous honor for me to be recognized by peers,” Fry said. “Best Lawyers® has such a good reputation in our legal industry, and deservedly so. They’ve done an excellent job of reporting on and evaluating our industry trends over the years.”

Contact Fry & Elder today to set up a personal consultation with a dedicated and experienced Tulsa family law attorney.

May 29

Rivas Leaving Fry & Elder to Launch Firm in Kendall Whittier

When Lorena Rivas first arrived at Fry & Elder in the fall of 2015, longtime divorce and child custody attorney Robert G “Hap” Fry Jr. quickly figured out that the young immigration lawyer would do great things at the firm.

“Lorena came right in and just put her nose to the grindstone,” Fry said. “I could tell right away that she had a tremendous work ethic, and she’s grown into a top-flight attorney in her field of immigration law. I could not be prouder of her.”

Of course, Fry is also a bit sad today.

Rivas, along with fellow attorneys and law school classmates Mary McMillen and Sara Schmook are leaving Fry & Elder to launch a firm in Tulsa’s diverse Kendall Whittier neighborhood on June 1. Immigration attorney Elissa Stiles will also join Rivas’ team.

“Today (is) bittersweet for me,” Rivas said on a recent social media post. “About 5 years ago, I joined the law firm of Fry & Elder. I was still a baby attorney then and was still getting my bearings set and ducks in order. During these last few years, I have been blessed and honored to be a part of Mr. Fry’s team.

“I have learned quite a bit from this man, from how to run a law firm to how to move past bumps in the legal profession to how to dance to a waltz. While I’m excited for what my future will hold in Kendall Whittier, I sure am going to miss the comfort of being at Fry & Elder. I’m glad I will still be able to count on Mr. Fry as my mentor and friend.”

The feelings are mutual.

Fry said his door at 1630 S. Main Street will always be open for any questions Rivas may have down the road and that he is looking forward to visiting her new office digs in Kendall Whittier and hopefully enjoying some street tacos for lunch with her staff.

“As difficult as it for me to see her go, it’s an excellent opportunity for Lorena,” Fry said. “She’s going to do great. Though we were only together for about five years, we really became close and we went through a lot of things together. She’s a throwback in many ways which I can appreciate. I never had a formal, written contract with her because her word was always her bond and that’s always impressed the hell out of me.”

Rivas literally blossomed into a superstar immigration attorney at Fry & Elder.

She’s been named to Super Lawyers® Rising Stars the past three years and has been the recipient of many local and national accolades.

One of Rivas’ most notable achievements came in 2018 when she won the Fern Holland Award which is awarded to a lawyer who advocates for human rights or the empowerment of women.

Rivas also delivered a riveting speech in 2019 at the American Heritage Awards in Orlando with her speech titled “This is America,” to close out the gala.

The highly-sought after immigration attorney has also traveled to Washington D.C. multiple times to meet with state and national legislators to discuss and advocate for immigration law reform.

As prominent as Rivas has been on the national stage, she has never lost site of her Oklahoma roots. Rivas’ Oklahoma allegiance was on full display in 2017 when she delivered an emotional speech at the University of Central Oklahoma’s Pre-Law Society Meeting.

Rivas discussed her upbringing in tiny Mutual, Oklahoma and what inspired her to become an immigration attorney. Her father being injured on an Oklahoma oil field when she was 4.

“We were a low-income family, but I remember who came to the rescue for (my parents) and it was an attorney,” said Rivas, a first-generation Mexican-American. “Somebody who took up their case, fought for them and got us some funds. Did we get a lot? No, probably not … But it was something to keep us going and allowed us to keep our house, keep food on the table and keep us dreaming. That is (when) I got my first taste of what an attorney is and how important they are to people.

“After seeing the importance of a lawyer, I knew I wanted to be somebody that important to somebody in their life and help them out.”

Fast forward some 25 years later and Rivas has become just that – someone who plays a very important role for many seeking immigration relief first at Fry & Elder and now at Kendall Whittier.

Best of luck Lorena Rivas!

May 27

Case Log Jam Forges Need for Experienced Tulsa Family Lawyer

By all accounts, James Morton is a seasoned and accomplished Tulsa family lawyer.

The Fry & Elder attorney has been practicing family law and domestic cases inside Oklahoma courtrooms for over 30 years, yet Morton knows he’s about to enter uncharted waters.

“It’s going to be different than anything I’ve ever seen,” Morton said. “It’s going to be a mess; it’s going to be like mining through a landfill.”

The mess Morton is referring to is the amount of backed-up cases – many of which involve child custody issues and protective orders – still awaiting a turn in front of a judge inside the Tulsa County Courthouse after the Coronavirus pandemic shut down the courthouse for nearly six weeks.

Though the Tulsa County Courthouse reopened its doors May 18, many safety precautions are now in place which has limited the number of people allowed inside a courtroom to no more than 10 and subsequently has caused a tremendous case log jam.

The climate is vastly different than the days when over 4,000 visitors would regularly enter the Tulsa County Courthouse before the Coronavirus pandemic struck as reported by the Tulsa World.

James Morton

“Safety definitely needs to come first,” Morton said. “But there also are a number of clients in some volatile and stressful situations they need resolved as soon as possible, making it all the more important that they have an experienced attorney advocating for them.”

Better days appear to be on the horizon.

The Tulsa District County Courthouse reported on its website that the Family Safety Center will open June 1 and will be able to then assist petitioners in complete Emergency Protective Orders. Read the full administrative order here from the Tulsa District County Courthouse.

Why You Need an Accomplished Tulsa Family Lawyer now more than ever

Because so many cases have been backed up, Morton believes there will be a very high number of status conferences in the upcoming weeks and months.

The purpose of these status conferences will be to reacquaint the judge and attorneys with the dynamics of various, specific cases. The hopeful result would be a request for a pre-trial or trial date.

“If you don’t have attorney, things could very easily fall through the cracks,” longtime Fry & Elder paralegal Judy Willits said. “If you have a pending domestic legal situation, it’s important that you not only have an attorney but one who is experienced in navigating through the court system.”

Few firms have more history or are more synonymous with Tulsa family law excellence than Fry & Elder.

The firm’s roots go all the way back to 1932 when C. Lawrence Elder began trying and wining cases in Oklahoma courtrooms.

The firm continues to be recognized as an industry leader in family law, having been selected to the U.S. News & World Report’s Best Law Firms List every year since 2014.

Robert G “Hap” Fry Jr. has been recognized by Best Lawyers® the past 10 years and has been named to Super Lawyers® every year since 2007.

Additionally, Fry is a Fellow of the American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers and is a Martindale-Hubble AV Preeminent Rated attorney.

Contact Fry & Elder today to set up a personal consultation with a seasoned and accomplished Tulsa family lawyer.

May 20

Co-Parenting During Coronavirus Poses Unique Challenges

Even without a world-wide pandemic, co-parenting is no easy task for many divorced and separated parents. Add the Coronavirus pandemic to the mix, and its easy to why co-parenting issues have become compounded and strained during these unforeseen and stressful times. The Tulsa family law firm of Fry & Elder recognizes and understands the difficulties co-parenting during Coronavirus has not only brought on many parents but also children living in Tulsa county.

The nationally recognized firm encourages that those co-parenting during Coronavirus to first and foremost keep the child’s best interests in mind and be open and honest with their communication efforts to their ex.

“I think one of the biggest issues we have been hearing about from current and prospective clients is the issue of social distancing,” said Robert G ‘Hap’ Fry Jr. “One parent will see things one way and the other a different way in regards to social distancing parameters and protocol. No question, these are stressful times for all parties involved which makes it even more important that parents give their children love and attention during these times.

“We really have been encouraging parents to try their best to put aside their differences and come up with an arrangement that not only best protects their child physically but also emotionally.”

Co-Parenting During Coronavirus: Communication is Key

Consistent and considerate communication plays a key role in any co-parenting situation. Parents are not going to see eye-to-eye on everything involving Coronavirus, but they need to be open with their ex about what type of safety and social-distancing protocols they are promoting with their child.

While keeping open-communication lines is paramount for those co-parenting during Coronavirus, it is just as important to be flexible and reasonable with one another.

The ability to compromise or give and take a little during these stressful times is often the difference between positive and negative co-parenting experience.

Co-Parenting During Coronavirus: Take Necessary Action When Prompted

If you feel your child’s health and safety are at risk, it goes without saying that you need to speak up.

Though the best approach would be to work out a solution with your ex, sometimes this is not an option, particularly when your ex is being unreasonable and unresponsive.

In the event of this situation, it would be wise to seek consultation with an experienced Tulsa family law attorney.

There are options available, but because the Tulsa Courthouse only recently re-opened, cases and pleadings are backed up so it is important to quickly consult with an attorney, particularly if your are seeking a child custody modification or an emergency protective order.

Contact Fry & Elder today to set up a personal consultation with a proven and accomplished Tulsa family law attorney.

Apr 29

Rivas’ Front-Line Accounts of Immigration Law Spotlighted in TulsaPeople

Lorena Rivas

When it comes to immigration law issues in Oklahoma or elsewhere, few people are more qualified to speak on the topic than Lorena Rivas.

The decorated Tulsa immigration attorney weighed in on the controversial issue of immigration law in a recent feature story by TulsaPeople Magazine titled “One at a Time.”

Written by Connie Cronley, the March 2020 piece chronicled those working on the front lines of immigration law in Tulsa and the challenges they encounter on a day-to-day basis.

Rivas is nationally known for her prowess in immigration law and was prominently spotlighted in the article. She had this to say in regards to the current climate of immigration law and her front-line accounts of immigration law:

“It’s really hard to be an immigration attorney now, especially with deportation cases,” Rivas says. “There are very few happy endings.” Sometimes success means winning the client more time in this country to prepare to leave.”

The investigative piece also highlighted how approximately 80 percent of Rivas’ clients are Spanish speaking and hail from Mexico, Honduras, Guatemala, El Salvador, Cuba, Venezuela and other South American countries.

One of Rivas’ clients the article focused on is a 35-year old mother of three – named “Marianna” in piece – who entered the United States 15 years ago as an asylum seeker.

Though all three of her children are U.S. citizens, Marianna was transported to an Oklahoma ICE detention center and “scheduled for deportation” after being involved in a South Tulsa traffic accident when authorities learned she did not have a driver’s license.

Although Rivas is attempting to reopen the case and Marianna has been released to take care of her children while her case is pending, the situation casts light on the frustration Rivas regularly faces as an in-demand immigration attorney.

“ICE is always present but more active now,” Rivas says. “This is a low point in American history.” The immigration system is broken, she says, “but taking hardline stances create more problems.”

The constant barrage of stress Rivas encounters led Cronley to ask Rivas why she continues to work in immigration law?

“I ask myself that, especially recently,” Rivas said. “But if I were to quit, there would be one less person on the front line. The unrepresented people in immigration court have a higher deportation rate. I would feel bad not helping them. I consider (myself) a public defender.”

An Accomplished Tulsa Immigration Law Attorney Second to None

Lorena Rivas’ accolades and accomplishments as an immigration lawyer are well documented. The decorated Oklahoma immigration attorney has been named a Super Lawyers® Rising Star each of the past two years and was recognized as the 2018 Fern Holland Award Winner – an honor annually given to a lawyer who advocates for human rights or the empowerment of women.

Considered by many to be an immigration law authority figure, Rivas has traveled to Washington D.C. multiple times to meet with legislators to discuss immigration law reform and improved policies.

Rivas was additionally recognized in 2016 by the Tulsa Business & Legal News as being one of the city’s most accomplished professional women with their annual Women of Distinction Awards.

Contact Lorena Rivas today to set up a personal consultation with an elite Tulsa immigration attorney.

Mar 19

Clients Encouraged to Utilize Digital Consultation Options

Since Fry & Elder first opened its doors in 1932 and began trying cases throughout Oklahoma courtrooms, the established Tulsa law firm has sought to implement innovative strategies to advocate for and support its clients during the most trying times.

As our country continues to navigate and respond to coronavirus (COVID-19), Fry & Elder wants its valued clients to know that the firm is fully to committed to its clientele and their health and safety.

The firm is taking appropriate safety precautions during these challenging days which includes enhanced hygiene, sanitation, social distancing and utilizing digital consultation platforms to hold private consultations.

Though the firm will continue to meet and consult with clients in a face-to-face office setting, Fry & Elder is available for confidential consultations and meetings using video-conferencing technology including FaceTime, Skype and Zoom. This would be the preferred method of conferencing as our country continues to promote social distancing in an effort to combat the spread of COVID-19.

“Our job as attorneys is to seek solutions for our clients which aid and assist them,” Robert G “Hap” Fry Jr. said. “Right now, there is a lot of unknown out there for all of us, and there are many who will feel more comfortable communicating digitally or by phone which we are more than happy to accommodate.

“Many of our clients are facing challenging situations, and we want our clients to be as comfortable as possible while always knowing that we are diligently working on their case.”

Fry & Elder has been selected to the U.S. News & World Report’s Best Law Firms list every year since 2014. Those interested in scheduling a private digital consultation should contact Fry & Elder at 918-585-1107 or by clicking here and submitting a request through email.

Nov 21

Sara Schmook Selected to OBA Leadership Academy

The 2019-2020 Oklahoma Bar Association Leadership Academy was recently announced, and Fry & Elder is again well represented.

Sara Schmook

Firm attorney Sara Schmook was one of just five Tulsa attorneys selected and becomes the fourth attorney from Fry & Elder to participate in the OBA Leadership Academy since its inception.

She joins Fry & Elder’s Lorena Rivas (2014) and former firm attorneys Luke Barteaux (2016) and Ruth Calvillo (2018) as Academy participants.

“I’m very honored to be chosen to the 2019-2020 Oklahoma Bar Association Leadership Academy,” Sara Schmook said. “The chance to collaborate with some of the sharpest and most driven legal minds in the state is a great opportunity for me. I look forward to representing Fry & Elder.”

The OBA Leadership Academy began in 2008 and includes select attorneys throughout the state. This year’s class features 18 attorneys with 10 from Oklahoma City, the previously mentioned five from Tulsa and one attorney each from Broken Arrow, Guthrie and Stillwater.

“Building quality leaders is important,” said OBA President Chuck Chesnut of Miami. “Participation in this academy helps individuals enhance their knowledge and skills, giving them tools to be better lawyers and leaders, which benefits their communities and the legal profession.”

Fry & Elder’s Sara Schmook a Leader in and out of the Courtroom

When Sara Schmook joined Fry & Elder in March of 2019, she further bolstered the firm’s rich tradition of being an elite Tulsa family law firm.

As a licensed CPA in the Tulsa-metro area, Schmook brings a dynamic skill set to the firm, making her and excellent choice for those clients going through a high-asset divorce.

Her legal practice at Fry & Elder is also unique in that much of it is tailored to focus on specific Oklahoma legal financial services such as guardianships, probates, estate planning, business formations and applications to the IRS for 501 (c)(3) not for profit organization

Schmook’s practice areas include:

“I’m relatively new to Fry & Elder, but I have enjoyed my time here,” Sara Schmook said. “The professionalism at this firm is great, and everyone operates at a very high level. The expectations are very high here.”

Contact Fry & Elder today to set up a personal consultation with Sara Schmook.